Now is our chance to choose the right side. God is holding back to give us that chance. It won’t last forever. We must take it or leave it. – C.S. Lewis
Safe trip to all who are traveling. Heard that the bus from P.Post will be carrying 43 of our teens- praise be to God! May these teens lead the call to end the destruction of human life in the embryo.
43 teens! Well,I thought someone said that the parish youth group was not even going???????? I'm tired of the rumors that discredit the parish efforts. The parish seems to be moving on nicely. Heard there were a ton of kids at the recent retreat- why wasn't that posted in a blog article?
ummm....the parish group is not going, but the FBI kids are. I think that is where the confusion is because in the bulletin it kept saying that the parish group was going but they didn't go.
Someone correct me if I am wrong, but the only people from our immediate area I've seen down here in DC are the FBI group from Corning and the usual Horseheads bus. Usually, people from our parish and the surrounding parishes gather at St. Peter's.
Just got back from the March for Life trip with the FBI in Washington DC! Attended a Youth Rally (with Bob Rice) and a very inspirational Mass at the Armory with 10,000+ teens. Then joined in the March down Constitution Avenue to the Supreme Court(with hundreds of thousands other groups of teens and their leaders, it was amazing!!) with a wonderful, committed, faithful group of our local Catholic and some non-catholic teens who whole heartingly support the choice of LIFE! I am inspired by their committment to ending the atrocities of abortion and chosing a culture that promotes life not dealth. Thank you Marie and Mike McCaig for bringing this opportunity to our teens!
Correct me if I am wrong Anon of 1/23 12:40 PM but when you wrote:
"Heard that the bus from P.Post will be carrying 43 of our teens- praise be to God!"
...didn't you just mean AREA teens?
I ask this so that we can just let go of the "us vs. them" mentality especially with regards to the youth. I used to work in Youth Ministry. Teens make choices to participate where they and their friends feel most comfortable. When I was the "new guy," my numbers were small because they didn't know me.
The most important thing to remember is that teens from our area went to the March to "take a stand" against abortion. I think Marie, Mike, Cory and any other adult that works with youth is happy about that. And so it God.
Anon 1/23 5:10PM. The March for Life pilgramage was organized by the FBI youth group staff in Conjuction with the Chemung County Right For Life, and was open to FBI YG members, and all C/PP area teens were welcome to join the trip. The FBI YG did this exact same March for Life pilgramage last year also. The bus has been filled both years. The ASP YG did not ultimately arrange a bus to go(as was advertised in the bulletin for 6 weeks). The ASP YG kids found out a week and a half before the March that they weren't "officially" going. They could sign up with HHDS bus(Dr. Spauldings group) if they wanted to go. Four of the ASP YG kids then rushed to sign up on the FBI bus as there were only a few seats left. Unfortunately, by Sunday, only one of them was able to make the trip to the March.
And as far as the recent ASP YG Retreat...there were 20 kids. The previous ASP YG Retreats had appr. 120 teens at them. So I quess it depends on what you consider "a ton". On average about 12 to 15 teens come to the Ignite group weekly.
Mary, I don't like the "us vs. them" mentality either, but I must saw that attitude comes more from our current ASP YG leader than anyone else. I'm just trying to convey some facts here, as things stated in the bulletin aren't always as they are presented.
There were 90+ kids registered for the new youth program, according to a previous article by Cory. In this light, 20 teens on a retreat is a poor showing but Mary is right( 9:04am) it takes time to build a program where teens are confortable. I would give Cory some support and a little more time, if things don't turn around with significant growth in participation, then there should be a re-evaluation of leadership and direction. If something is broken, it will need to be fixed.
Does it really matter how the students get to the March or who takes them? I am just encouraged that so many went! However, it was very misleading to state repeatedly in the bulletin that our parish was taking a group, when, apparently, we didn't. I have been to the March for Life and it's a great experience. Even though I don't personally know anyone that attended, many thanks are due to the FBI group for making the trip possible. Also, next year, please let people know if there are students that need scholarships.
Well, Dean tried to fix something that wasn't "broke"..but he thinks he's the guru with all the answers for this parish when in fact he's not. Until he and his "team" comes to grips with the facts, there will be no growth with the youth program.
1:25 pm- Good points. Just one correction- I recall when there were 200 teens on the retreats. When my son staffed, there were 175. So, things have changed and I'm glad that my son was able to participate when he did. I know from personal experience that many lives were changed through the whole teen retreat experience.
Ok..I think we are losing sight of the real problem...Saving Our Parish....we are talking about who went where on what bus...which is ok...but thought the purpose of this sight was to discuss how we can save St. Vincent's...let's stop pulling apart everything that is going on and get to the real problem....SOP...I don't have answers for the real problem but we need some fresh ideas...the old ones are not working...no one is listening to us...we need help and input...let's pray for enlightenment on where to go next...
7:55. If this website was targeting a single issue, as you suggest, it would be called "Saving Saint Vincent's" and not "Saving Our Parish". We are not losing sight by being mindful of all the issues that have broken, and continue to break, the spirit of the parish.
7:55- Frankly, as much I as I had hoped we could save Saint Vincent's, I think that our continued efforts, while noble, will be fruitless. Parish leaders are moving ahead regardless of how you or I or a majority in the parish feel. People should be allowed and encouraged to express their feelings about other areas where there are problems. The youth ministry program is one that many are still sensitive about- we have gone from hundreds to a handful.The RCIA numbers should be a great concern- the number of new candidates have never been lower. We have a church that is shrinking, from the youth to the new members and most obviously with parishioners who have left. So, let's not just focus on Saint Vincent's, the problem is much bigger than this one building.
Let's face it. The youth are the future of the parish-not the buildings, AV equipment and stage presence. I know some say to let go of the past but it's simply not that easy. We need to move ahead with new leadership of the parish.
If you haven't already noticed, closing churches means losing parishioners, too. That is the part of the equation the leadership is willing to accept. Less places to worship equals less worshipers. If they can't be bothered to keep up the buidings, what makes anyone think they will be bothered trying to keep up membership?
This has been stated before but I will reiterate-Current leadership (including the youth leader) would rather have fewer people, all who "go along", than to contend with more people, many who question and challenge. This is blatantly obvious. So, threats of "I'm not coming" or "We'll just leave" are ineffective. A better approach is: "You can't make me leave, I will be a vocal advocate for the truth in this parish" This approach might bring about the change that is needed much more effectively than the exodus we are experiencing. I specifically mention the youth because we are registered parishioners, with 2 teenaged children and we did not recieve a mailing with an invitation to the Ignite retreat. In the past, all teens from the parish were personally invited, regardless of whether or not you were participating in the program.In fact, if we didn't respond to a mailed invitation, we received a phone call! Pulpit and bulletin announcments do not attract teens but someone reaching out on a personal level does. Sorry to keep bringing up the youth program, but as was stated by 9:35 above, the youth are the future of the parish and, right now, the future is very bleak. Someone should be asking. "Where are the teens?" and "How can we get them back?"
Just curious, 10:56, if you knew about the retreat, why didn't you send your 2 children? And, to respond to your question, "How can we get YOUR children back?" I'm not trying to stir the pot, I am dead serious. There IS a problem. Only 20 kids were at the retreat. There are 500-600 teens in the parish. You ask a good question, "Where are the teens" but we can't fix the problem unless someone identifies it. Stating that we want things back the way it used to be is not a solution. How can we move forward if teens won't participate?
Teens don't want programs and preaching. They get enough of that at school. They want caring, ownership, someone they trust, feeling comfortable when any "teen" problem comes up, and, adults who have always had their backs and been there for them, not just on Sunday nights. Take a look back and all of that was present. So, they have naturally gravitated to where their needs are looked after. It took years and years to build the trust and the only carrot being held in front of them is eternity with God.
If their needs were being met, this conversation would not be taking place. Mandating attendance as part of making their confirmation and flowing articles in the bulletins, for affect, just doesn't do it. And we all know, even you, who the BIG problem is so let's cut to the chase and stop beating around the bush.
3:12- I know because I listen to my kids who I MADE TRY THE PROGRAM for a whole year.It's not working. I don't have all the answers and I am not pointing fingers but something does need to change. The entire church suffers when the youth are disconnected.
Regarding the comments about youth ministry...I will give my 2 cents worth.
Presently, I have children too young to attend youth ministry so I can't say anything about present or past programs here at this church. I know Marie & Mike and I know how the YM program was run at that time but that is the extent of my knowledge of ASP YM programs past and present.
Having worked in YM I know that different parish need different types of YM programs. But, one overall type of youth ministry that can work in a variety of parishes (as a foundation) is Relational Youth Ministry....basically, relating to youth where they are...or forming indiv. relationships. While this does take a great deal of time and energy it usually reaps great rewards.
What does this look like? Going to where the kids are (i.e. sports events, school events,) and just talking to a few kids, each time. You might still hold your catechesis classes in which you only get 10-15 kids...but, when you see teen, especially outside of a church event, you engage them in conversation. If you know something about them or teens in general (like that the high schoolers have midterms) talk to them about that and say that you will pray for them if they would like.
Someone mentioned phone calls...I agree who heartedly with that comment. When I did that with some of my programs (sent out invites and then followed up phone calls) I was amazed what a difference it made. Little by little the flock grew. Personal invitation makes a huge difference -- even for getting volunteers. (That was how I first got introduced to YM...our Parish YM called and asked me to teach R.E. -- 3 years later I was a part-time YM at a small church)
Relational Youth Ministry....it takes many different forms (depending on the leader) but, if its genuine, caring, heart-felt and Spirit-centered it will WORK MIRACLES.
Mary- Have you offered to help/advise Cory? You have insight and experience that is lacking. Many hands are needed if the youth program is ever going to be resurrected.
11:57- I did know about the retreat and did mention it to my children but, based on their experiences of last year, would not force them to attend. I think you miss my point, many kids did try the program last year. Most didn't like it. Ask the parish how many of the confirmation kids have returned and how many have left. You won't read these numbers in the long-winded bulletin articles. To answer your question about what it will take to get my children back. Honestly, I think it's too late. With kids you get one chance to make a good first impression. Also, I have noticed that this blog always goes back to the kids. That's where we hurt the most and who we hurt the most.
Previously it was all about the kids. It would be great if someone would write about ALL of the past experiences our kids had to participate in through youth group. Our youth group was strong and vibrant but it drew attention away from someone else and so it was ended...contrary to what I'm sure you will hear about this comment.
9:08 is right, it is the kids who have been hurt the most. As a faith community we have an obligation to nurture the faith of our youth. If you are not happy with the parish programs, start your own. Meet in homes. Take turns teaching. Get some good resourses. Talk to our home school parents to see how it is done. It's time that we forget about trying to change the current direction and pave our own.
Anon of 1/27 @ 9:07...No, not really. I introduced myself last year after mass one Sunday. Asked if he heard of a few programs. And his comment was something like -- email me or call me. Frankly, when I was a YM and someone came forward with an idea...I always asked for their name and number and immediately put it on paper. My feeling was, it was my responsibility (as a paid employee of the parish) to contact them. I didn't really feel like he was interested in my ideas.
Plus, I have little kids so my time is precious to me...he should have contacted me. (Not that he asked for my name and number) I know my thinking is somewhat selfish and in a few years perhaps I will volunteer in YM but, it just doesn't seem like my input is needed or valued.
Mary- Sorry to hear that but not surprised. Are you open to working with youth in another capacity??????? I agree with 3:31- let's reclaim our teens for the Catholic faith.
Would like to comment on the teen retreat. Someone stated earlier that all teens received a written invitation and then a phone call if they did not respond. I don't recall any of this with the retreats that were held in past years. The sign ups were given out at youth group and were not mailed out to the teens. As for trying the program for whole year ,our YM did not start until January of last year so he was not even here for the full year last year. The program was run the same as it waS in the past, one hour of a lesson on Sunday night, so I was just wondering what part of the program is not working. The FBI is continually brought up, it is too bad that our previous YM did not include some of these activities into the parish youth program when she was working for the church. Never brought the teens to the March in Washington then! Most of the kids that are now involved in youth group or FBI were not even attending youth group when all the trouble started so what do they have to compare it to! It is bascially what they hear the adults talking about!
Just to comment on youth group. When our YM was beginning his duties of YM he asked for parents to be on the youth board and help with the planning of the activities. How many parents actually stepped forward to help? Just like in past years it was always the same group of parents that helped out. Many of the adults that helped on the retreats in the past were not even parents. Most of the teens that would be participating in the retreat now were not old enough to participate in the past retreats, so how can they compare something that they have not been involved in, This was the first retreat that was held by the new youth minister, so how would any teen know what is was like if they did not attend this one!
Quote from 2:13pm:"The program was run the same as it waS in the past, one hour of a lesson on Sunday night". WAKE UP!!!!It's not about the program, it's about the leadership. You can defend all you want, but the fact of the matter is, kids aren't coming. MY children aren't coming because they are uncomfortable. My oldest was confirmed last year and none of the kids who were confirmed with him are coming to the high school program. NONE OF THEM. I know this because I saw the picture of the 20 teens who were on the retreat. Where are the kids? I know where they are, they are taking their sacrament and running. So, go ahead, sit around and pretend that everything is fine. Your remarks to discredit the old YM (Her name is Marie McCaig) are pathetic. Really? After all she did to humbly and lovingly share the faith with hundreds and hundreds of our teens, how could you be so low?
2:23- You are incorrect. In the past, parents were always welcome but my kids never wanted me around, whether at the regular meetings on Sunday nights or at the retreats. So what is your point? We were always invited to help but if your child doesn't want you there, why impose? Besides, leading teens in ministry is a gift and we don't all have it. There was always plenty of help with parents and non-parents, so what is your point? Is it wrong to get other people involved? Cory specifically stated at a meeting I attended that he wanted people to be Core Leaders WHO WERE NOT PARENTS, so what is your point? Several young people did get involved as Core Leaders and they have all quit! In fact, he wrote in the bulletin that he wanted to interview and train 25-30 Core Leaders- not a very realistic goal, all things considered.
2:23 You are correct. Most of the teens that are of-age now to participate are not familiar with how things used to be, so they aren't gaging their current experience on an experience of the past. This fact makes it even more disturbing that they aren't supporting the new program and Cory. Don't you think? Word of mouth is how things grow. When the program is not growing, the word that is out is not favorable. It's nearly impossible to undue the damage of first impressions.
Anonymous 2:13, People who live in glass houses ought not to throw stones. If Prolife issues and the March for Life had ever been a priority in this parish, I'm sure the turnout each year for the pilgrimage would've been better. In fact, what happened this year? No bus. When was the last time our parish filled a bus with pilgrims? Parish kids who wanted to go weren't able to because of the way in which it was handled. However, the FBI group and Horseheads had full buses. Why? Please stop blaming Marie and look inward. Ask God to open your blind eyes.
The adults in our parish are hardly engaged, so how would you expect the youth to be? There are a few of the faithful who make this pilgrimage almost every year in our parish. Do you know who they are? Are you one of them?
Do you say rosaries in front of the Planned Parenthood in Corning? Are you engaged in the Respect Life Committee? Do you attend vigil masses for the unborn when offered? Are they even offered in our parish? Do you speak up when abortion comes up in conversation with friends and co-workers? Do you prayerfully support the Prolife movement? Do you engage the young people in your life on this issue?
I have been to the March for Life twice in the last three years. Both times I saw Marie with lots of kids. She is obviously doing something right.
What parish staff cannot seem to accept is that the issues surrounding the fractured youth group will not go away. Those who rule us with a sense of entitlement and arrogance instead of a servant's heart continue on in the same way. It is a spiritual problem that calls out for the Holy Spirit. At this point, humility and penance on the part of leadership would be a start.
In comment to 9:56 my remarks were not to discredit what Marie McCaig did or did not do. The program was good but unfortunately we do not live in a perfect world. We came in from another parish that had a very active youth group with both social activities and instruction, in comparing it to what we were used to my teenagers were disappointed even though we thought alot of the Mrs, McCaig. They attended youth group, but there was very little time to socialize and get to know anyone except for the once a year retreat. I wish that they could have had some of the experiences that I now hear the FBI is doing because that is what they experienced at our other parish. Change is always hard. It was also our experience that a handful of teens and the same parents were always at any of the fund raisers or activities that went on. Attendance was very high for the retreat, but many of those teens never took part in anything else. I was glad to see that the teens did have an opportunity this year to attend a retreat. I am sure that the first ones that the McCaigs held were not as big as the later ones were. It does take time for a program to be built up and hopefully those core group of teens through word of mouth will be able to do this.
Gretchen just wondering how much you were involved with the youth group when Marie McCaig was in charge and did your teens take part in any of the programs then or since they have started the FBI group. Maybe you should think about not throwing stones in a glass house. When the trouble started with the youth group did you attend any of the parent meetings and voice your opinion about what a good job Mrs. McCaig was doing? My point was that if this was a priority why didn't the youth attend before last year with the FBI. I did not hear of any parish kids who wanted to go and couldn't go because of the way it was handled. It is my understanding that the bus to the March sponsored by the FBI was open to everyone.
Thank you for your level-headed reason, 3:26. As one who has been involved in parish happenings for many years, your perspective is quite accurate. I don't seen any arguments on here about issues regarding the substance in the program, just about who is running it and who has the control, which I think is quite shallow. I don't have teens to send to our church program, but let us pray that parents get past their disagreements and do whats best for their children's spiritual life and faith formation!
3:26 Sorry to disagree, but my kids are involved in the FBI and my senior daughter was always involved in the old program- the FBI kids are doing many of the things they did before, only in a bigger capacity. They had service projects before- where were you? They visited the elderly before- where were you? They wrote letters to shut-ins- where were you? They made stockings at Christmas time- where were you? They raked and cleaned for the elderly- where were you? Again, where were you? I'm sure I have forgotten many of the wonderful things that were accomplished but I hope you get my point because you are attempting to discredit what both Marie and Mike did but few will buy into it. And, by the way, she was a part-time employee, wasn't she? In this regard, we should be getting twice as much bang for our buck now.
2:13, 2:23 and 3:26 obviously you are the same person because there could not possibly be 3 people who are so foolish. ARE YOU FREAKING KIDDING ME? Over 120plus kids were going to a youth group meeting every Sunday night and you are whining because they didn't have enough social time????? I whined because I couldn't get a parking spot to pick my kids up and now look what we've got. Unbelievable. I wanted my children catechized and cared for and they were. Thank you Marie and Mike.
3:26 FYI- you can't compare what was to what is. When there are only 12 or so kids at a gathering, social interaction is easy. When Marie did it, there were always 100 kids at a meeting and her role was to educate. I was fine with this and so were my children. They get enough of the social stuff at school and on their teams.
Anonymous 3:43, We moved to this parish after Marie had been ousted. We attended two youth council meetings, in which the parents and youth group volunteers were urging the pastoral administrator to reinstate Marie and to heal the rift. We had no clue what was going on, but knew something was seriously wrong, so we stopped attending. As newcomers, we felt we didn't have much to offer. We attended the final youth retreat at the parish run by the McCaigs, however. We volunteered in the kitchen. It was fantastic, and my kids, who attended, agreed.
Regarding the bus -- our parish bulletin advertised for weeks that our parish would be sending a bus to the March. I personally know of one teen who wanted to go and was expecting to be able to go with the parish youth group. By the time she found out no parish bus was going it was too late to sign on with the FBI bus -- it was filled.
Must be there was a Parish Council or Youth Group meeting last night and and it must have been decided that some of you needed to go on this blog to defend the current YM while trying to discredit Marie and the many years of that she faithfully serving the youth of our parish. How PATHETIC!! @ 1/31 2:13PM-To criticize that she never took the teens to March for Life while she was the YM at ASP...really?? Marie was a PART TIME employee of ASP with multiple children at home. She was at almost every school & sporting event, Graduation parties & teens celebrations, volunteered in the schools, sewed costumes and worked backstage on the plays, and participated in Booster Club to name a few. She even did these things for the HS when she did not have a child in the school. Her door was always open for our teens. She was there for them no matter what. She CARED for the kids. No hidden agendas! She ran a vibrant YG program and was and still is loved and repected by the teens in this community Catholics and non Catholics alike! And as far as March for Life... and the ASP YG not going...Cory is a single man who is employed FULL TIME by ASP, and he could not make a couple of phone calls and organize a bus, when a system is already in place through Chemung County Right for Life to set it up quite easily. It appears to me that it didn't happen due to shear laziness or the fact that he didn't want to get it together because he might have to compete with the FBI?? @ 1/31 2:23PM... My kids were involved when Marie was YM and there are many senior high kids that attend the FBI that were also. So we know how it "was". As far as the recent ASP Retreat and it being the first one so how would we know that we wouldn't like it, if you don't like what is offered at the Sunday evening program, why would you want to sit through it for 2 days?
The FBI has a retreat coming up Feb. 20-21st. My kids and and well over 100 more will be there!
4:06 Who is running it is everything! You can't really believe otherwise. If so, you better get your head out of the sand. The church is no different than anything else- there are coaches in this district that my son will never play for. His choice and I wouldn't either. You're either good with kids or you're not and kids are the best judge.
6:46 My 2 will be there too. We received our invitation in the mail today and it was as welcomed as much as the "snow day" announcement! It's pretty incredible that despite some division among the adults, the kids all come together. They really don't care about all of the behind-the-scene politics, they just want to have a faith experience with their friends. So, whether it be through the parish or through the FBI, maybe we can all agree that the most important thing is that there are options and opportunities for our teens. Let's face it, all teens are not created equal. Some will navigate toward a small, intimate group and their needs are better met and some thrive in a larger-group environment. It might be nice if the 2 groups would collaborate occasionally but maybe it's not realistic.
10:19pm: As I have followed this blog I could never figure out why so much dissention over the 2 groups for the kids. I don't have kids involved anymore but I used to and as far as I'm concerned, the more the better. Kids get to chose between soccer or football or cross country in the fall or basketball or track or volleyball in the winter. Having different chances to be successful are critical. So if kids are successful in their faith journey through the parish group- great. If they do better through Marie and the FBI, great. What difference does it make how they get to God, as long as they get there? Let's support them on their journey, unconditionally. I sense that a majority of the opposition comes from the staff- the message that the FBI is your nemesis has to stop. You are driving parents and their children away.
Nancy- You are on target but leave me wondering how the FBI group, who serves the community in many valuable ways, could be the enemy? I see the hand of Satan in all of this, as he seeks to destroy all good that is from God. He is the true nemesis.
The FBI group is what it is.. a great group of teens who are involved, active and giving of their time in various service projects. Who benefits? The kids do, the community does and the elderly delight in seeing them often. The adults who support them are both parents and friends, listeners and supporters. No one asks to be spotlighted or above anyone else, most of all Marie and Mike..never have, never will. Ask any teens from the present or past who have been involved a lot, or off and on, and you'll hear postive and rewarding experiences and memories. All of us parents will attest to the fact that kids know what's going on. They will attach themselves to adults who are sincere and always there for them unconditionally..no gimmicks. That's why it is a successful gathering and why the FBI retreat is well attended without twisting anyone's arm.
Just recovering from having the kids home for 2 days and would like to respond to the person(s) who posted at 2:13 and 2:23. I was one of the parents you refer to- I never staffed a retreat, even though I was asked by Marie if I would consider it. Why? Because I was and am still intimidated by 150-175 teens. It's that simple. I will cook, I will clean, I will do whatever, but I won't be a staff person. I hope you don't think that makes me a bad parent but I recognize where my weaknesses are. Besides, my kids wouldn't go if I was there. Also, about the comment you made about kids going to the retreat and then never coming to youth group. There was some of this going on because the retreats were opened up to all denominations, so naturally these other teens would not come to a Catholic youth group. Also, there were a ton of kids coming to the Sunday night program, so most of them must have been doing both the retreat and the youth group activities. I remember when my oldest was a junior and she went to the Steubenville retreat and they filled 2 chartered buses. So, again, it wasn't just about the retreat, these kids were involved in other things. I also remember the Service week they used to do and how a ton of kids showed up to work their butts off. So, I think you are wrong about a few of the things you are stating. Like I said, I wasn't a staff adult but we were involved and I have not forgotten all the things that used to happen to help our children.
He said, she said, FBI, ASP YG, who cares. How many teens involved now vs. how many participated 5 yrs ago? An effective, real parish leader would have ended this nonsense long ago. Big void at the top, both in Corning & Rochester.
He supports HIS program is exactly correct because previously they were not in atendance at any of the retreats..too busy at Victory Hgwy. Maybe that's why "anyone would ask such a question".
Of course they are involved now! He has molded the new program to meet his needs. He's got a puppet on a string and everything is good in his eyes. So what if we are missing 75% of the kids...who cares about them? As long as we can brag in the bulletin how good things are going, that's what matters.
Safe trip to all who are traveling. Heard that the bus from P.Post will be carrying 43 of our teens- praise be to God! May these teens lead the call to end the destruction of human life in the embryo.
ReplyDelete43 teens! Well,I thought someone said that the parish youth group was not even going???????? I'm tired of the rumors that discredit the parish efforts. The parish seems to be moving on nicely. Heard there were a ton of kids at the recent retreat- why wasn't that posted in a blog article?
ReplyDeleteummm....the parish group is not going, but the FBI kids are. I think that is where the confusion is because in the bulletin it kept saying that the parish group was going but they didn't go.
ReplyDeletehmmm. Guess they have their act together... again.
ReplyDeleteSomeone correct me if I am wrong, but the only people from our immediate area I've seen down here in DC are the FBI group from Corning and the usual Horseheads bus. Usually, people from our parish and the surrounding parishes gather at St. Peter's.
ReplyDeleteJust got back from the March for Life trip with the FBI in Washington DC! Attended a Youth Rally (with Bob Rice) and a very inspirational Mass at the Armory with 10,000+ teens. Then joined in the March down Constitution Avenue to the Supreme Court(with hundreds of thousands other groups of teens and their leaders, it was amazing!!) with a wonderful, committed, faithful group of our local Catholic and some non-catholic teens who whole heartingly support the choice of LIFE! I am inspired by their committment to ending the atrocities of abortion and chosing a culture that promotes life not dealth. Thank you Marie and Mike McCaig for bringing this opportunity to our teens!
ReplyDeleteCorrect me if I am wrong Anon of 1/23 12:40 PM but when you wrote:
ReplyDelete"Heard that the bus from P.Post will be carrying 43 of our teens- praise be to God!"
...didn't you just mean AREA teens?
I ask this so that we can just let go of the "us vs. them" mentality especially with regards to the youth. I used to work in Youth Ministry. Teens make choices to participate where they and their friends feel most comfortable. When I was the "new guy," my numbers were small because they didn't know me.
The most important thing to remember is that teens from our area went to the March to "take a stand" against abortion. I think Marie, Mike, Cory and any other adult that works with youth is happy about that. And so it God.
Mary- "our" refers to our local Catholic teens. Please don't read anything more into it.
ReplyDeleteAnon 1/23 5:10PM. The March for Life pilgramage was organized by the FBI youth group staff in Conjuction with the Chemung County Right For Life, and was open to FBI YG members, and all C/PP area teens were welcome to join the trip. The FBI YG did this exact same March for Life pilgramage last year also. The bus has been filled both years. The ASP YG did not ultimately arrange a bus to go(as was advertised in the bulletin for 6 weeks). The ASP YG kids found out a week and a half before the March that they weren't "officially" going. They could sign up with HHDS bus(Dr. Spauldings group) if they wanted to go. Four of the ASP YG kids then rushed to sign up on the FBI bus as there were only a few seats left. Unfortunately, by Sunday, only one of them was able to make the trip to the March.
ReplyDeleteAnd as far as the recent ASP YG Retreat...there were 20 kids. The previous ASP YG Retreats had appr. 120 teens at them. So I quess it depends on what you consider "a ton". On average about 12 to 15 teens come to the Ignite group weekly.
Mary, I don't like the "us vs. them" mentality either, but I must saw that attitude comes more from our current ASP YG leader than anyone else. I'm just trying to convey some facts here, as things stated in the bulletin aren't always as they are presented.
There were 90+ kids registered for the new youth program, according to a previous article by Cory. In this light, 20 teens on a retreat is a poor showing but Mary is right( 9:04am) it takes time to build a program where teens are confortable. I would give Cory some support and a little more time, if things don't turn around with significant growth in participation, then there should be a re-evaluation of leadership and direction. If something is broken, it will need to be fixed.
ReplyDeleteDoes it really matter how the students get to the March or who takes them? I am just encouraged that so many went! However, it was very misleading to state repeatedly in the bulletin that our parish was taking a group, when, apparently, we didn't. I have been to the March for Life and it's a great experience. Even though I don't personally know anyone that attended, many thanks are due to the FBI group for making the trip possible. Also, next year, please let people know if there are students that need scholarships.
ReplyDeleteChris
Well, Dean tried to fix something that wasn't "broke"..but he thinks he's the guru with all the answers for this parish when in fact he's not. Until he and his "team" comes to grips with the facts, there will be no growth with the youth program.
ReplyDelete1:25 pm- Good points. Just one correction- I recall when there were 200 teens on the retreats.
ReplyDeleteWhen my son staffed, there were 175. So, things have changed and I'm glad that my son was able to participate when he did. I know from personal experience that many lives were changed through the whole teen retreat experience.
Ok..I think we are losing sight of the real problem...Saving Our Parish....we are talking about who went where on what bus...which is ok...but thought the purpose of this sight was to discuss how we can save St. Vincent's...let's stop pulling apart everything that is going on and get to the real problem....SOP...I don't have answers for the real problem but we need some fresh ideas...the old ones are not working...no one is listening to us...we need help and input...let's pray for enlightenment on where to go next...
ReplyDelete7:55. If this website was targeting a single issue, as you suggest, it would be called "Saving Saint Vincent's" and not "Saving Our Parish". We are not losing sight by being mindful of all the issues that have broken, and continue to break, the spirit of the parish.
ReplyDeletePerhaps the question is: How do we maintain a Catholic community in such a situation?
ReplyDelete7:55- Frankly, as much I as I had hoped we could save Saint Vincent's, I think that our continued efforts, while noble, will be fruitless. Parish leaders are moving ahead regardless of how you or I or a majority in the parish feel. People should be allowed and encouraged to express their feelings about other areas where there are problems. The youth ministry program is one that many are still sensitive about- we have gone from hundreds to a handful.The RCIA numbers should be a great concern- the number of new candidates have never been lower. We have a church that is shrinking, from the youth to the new members and most obviously with parishioners who have left. So, let's not just focus on Saint Vincent's, the problem is much bigger than this one building.
ReplyDeleteLet's face it. The youth are the future of the parish-not the buildings, AV equipment and stage presence. I know some say to let go of the past but it's simply not that easy. We need to move ahead with new leadership of the parish.
ReplyDeleteIf you haven't already noticed, closing churches means losing parishioners, too. That is the part of the equation the leadership is willing to accept. Less places to worship equals less worshipers. If they can't be bothered to keep up the buidings, what makes anyone think they will be bothered trying to keep up membership?
ReplyDeleteThis has been stated before but I will reiterate-Current leadership (including the youth leader) would rather have fewer people, all who "go along", than to contend with more people, many who question and challenge. This is blatantly obvious. So, threats of "I'm not coming" or "We'll just leave" are ineffective. A better approach is: "You can't make me leave, I will be a vocal advocate for the truth in this parish" This approach might bring about the change that is needed much more effectively than the exodus we are experiencing. I specifically mention the youth because we are registered parishioners, with 2 teenaged children and we did not recieve a mailing with an invitation to the Ignite retreat. In the past, all teens from the parish were personally invited, regardless of whether or not you were participating in the program.In fact, if we didn't respond to a mailed invitation, we received a phone call! Pulpit and bulletin announcments do not attract teens but someone reaching out on a personal level does. Sorry to keep bringing up the youth program, but as was stated by 9:35 above, the youth are the future of the parish and, right now, the future is very bleak. Someone should be asking. "Where are the teens?" and "How can we get them back?"
ReplyDeleteJust curious, 10:56, if you knew about the retreat, why didn't you send your 2 children? And, to respond to your question, "How can we get YOUR children back?" I'm not trying to stir the pot, I am dead serious. There IS a problem. Only 20 kids were at the retreat. There are 500-600 teens in the parish. You ask a good question, "Where are the teens" but we can't fix the problem unless someone identifies it. Stating that we want things back the way it used to be is not a solution. How can we move forward if teens won't participate?
ReplyDeleteTeens don't want programs and preaching. They get enough of that at school. They want caring, ownership, someone they trust, feeling comfortable when any "teen" problem comes up, and, adults who have always had their backs and been there for them, not just on Sunday nights. Take a look back and all of that was present. So, they have naturally gravitated to where their needs are looked after. It took years and years to build the trust and the only carrot being held in front of them is eternity with God.
ReplyDelete2:21 You still haven't identified the problem- how do you know that the current program does not meet these needs?
ReplyDeleteIf their needs were being met, this conversation would not be taking place. Mandating attendance as part of making their confirmation and flowing articles in the bulletins, for affect, just doesn't do it. And we all know, even you, who the BIG problem is so let's cut to the chase and stop beating around the bush.
ReplyDelete3:12- I know because I listen to my kids who I MADE TRY THE PROGRAM for a whole year.It's not working. I don't have all the answers and I am not pointing fingers but something does need to change. The entire church suffers when the youth are disconnected.
ReplyDeleteRegarding the comments about youth ministry...I will give my 2 cents worth.
ReplyDeletePresently, I have children too young to attend youth ministry so I can't say anything about present or past programs here at this church. I know Marie & Mike and I know how the YM program was run at that time but that is the extent of my knowledge of ASP YM programs past and present.
Having worked in YM I know that different parish need different types of YM programs. But, one overall type of youth ministry that can work in a variety of parishes (as a foundation) is Relational Youth Ministry....basically, relating to youth where they are...or forming indiv. relationships. While this does take a great deal of time and energy it usually reaps great rewards.
What does this look like? Going to where the kids are (i.e. sports events, school events,) and just talking to a few kids, each time. You might still hold your catechesis classes in which you only get 10-15 kids...but, when you see teen, especially outside of a church event, you engage them in conversation. If you know something about them or teens in general (like that the high schoolers have midterms) talk to them about that and say that you will pray for them if they would like.
Someone mentioned phone calls...I agree who heartedly with that comment. When I did that with some of my programs (sent out invites and then followed up phone calls) I was amazed what a difference it made. Little by little the flock grew. Personal invitation makes a huge difference -- even for getting volunteers. (That was how I first got introduced to YM...our Parish YM called and asked me to teach R.E. -- 3 years later I was a part-time YM at a small church)
Relational Youth Ministry....it takes many different forms (depending on the leader) but, if its genuine, caring, heart-felt and Spirit-centered it will WORK MIRACLES.
But, that is just my 2 cents worth.
Mary- Have you offered to help/advise Cory? You have insight and experience that is lacking. Many hands are needed if the youth program is ever going to be resurrected.
ReplyDelete11:57- I did know about the retreat and did mention it to my children but, based on their experiences of last year, would not force them to attend. I think you miss my point, many kids did try the program last year. Most didn't like it. Ask the parish how many of the confirmation kids have returned and how many have left. You won't read these numbers in the long-winded bulletin articles. To answer your question about what it will take to get my children back. Honestly, I think it's too late. With kids you get one chance to make a good first impression.
ReplyDeleteAlso, I have noticed that this blog always goes back to the kids. That's where we hurt the most and who we hurt the most.
Previously it was all about the kids. It would be great if someone would write about ALL of the past experiences our kids had to participate in through youth group. Our youth group was strong and vibrant but it drew attention away from someone else and so it was ended...contrary to what I'm sure you will hear about this comment.
ReplyDeleteI think it was too traditional, it wasn't charismatic enough for leadership.
ReplyDelete9:08 is right, it is the kids who have been hurt the most. As a faith community we have an obligation to nurture the faith of our youth. If you are not happy with the parish programs, start your own. Meet in homes. Take turns teaching. Get some good resourses. Talk to our home school parents to see how it is done. It's time that we forget about trying to change the current direction and pave our own.
ReplyDeleteAnon of 1/27 @ 9:07...No, not really. I introduced myself last year after mass one Sunday. Asked if he heard of a few programs. And his comment was something like -- email me or call me. Frankly, when I was a YM and someone came forward with an idea...I always asked for their name and number and immediately put it on paper. My feeling was, it was my responsibility (as a paid employee of the parish) to contact them. I didn't really feel like he was interested in my ideas.
ReplyDeletePlus, I have little kids so my time is precious to me...he should have contacted me. (Not that he asked for my name and number) I know my thinking is somewhat selfish and in a few years perhaps I will volunteer in YM but, it just doesn't seem like my input is needed or valued.
Join the group!
ReplyDeleteMary- Sorry to hear that but not surprised. Are you open to working with youth in another capacity??????? I agree with 3:31- let's reclaim our teens for the Catholic faith.
ReplyDeleteWould like to comment on the teen retreat. Someone stated earlier that all teens received a written invitation and then a phone call if they did not respond. I don't recall any of this with the retreats that were held in past years. The sign ups were given out at youth group and were not mailed out to the teens. As for trying the program for whole year ,our YM did not start until January of last year so he was not even here for the full year last year. The program was run the same as it waS in the past, one hour of a lesson on Sunday night, so I was just wondering what part of the program is not working. The FBI is continually brought up, it is too bad that our previous YM did not include some of these activities into the parish youth program when she was working for the church. Never brought the teens to the March in Washington then! Most of the kids that are now involved in youth group or FBI were not even attending youth group when all the trouble started so what do they have to compare it to! It is bascially what they hear the adults talking about!
ReplyDeleteJust to comment on youth group. When our YM was beginning his duties of YM he asked for parents to be on the youth board and help with the planning of the activities. How many parents actually stepped forward to help? Just like in past years it was always the same group of parents that helped out. Many of the adults that helped on the retreats in the past were not even parents. Most of the teens that would be participating in the retreat now were not old enough to participate in the past retreats, so how can they compare something that they have not been involved in, This was the first retreat that was held by the new youth minister, so how would any teen know what is was like if they did not attend this one!
ReplyDeleteThank you for the common sense perspective, 2:13 and 2:23 PM!! Couldn't agree with you more.
ReplyDeleteQuote from 2:13pm:"The program was run the same as it waS in the past, one hour of a lesson on Sunday night". WAKE UP!!!!It's not about the program, it's about the leadership. You can defend all you want, but the fact of the matter is, kids aren't coming. MY children aren't coming because they are uncomfortable. My oldest was confirmed last year and none of the kids who were confirmed with him are coming to the high school program. NONE OF THEM. I know this because I saw the picture of the 20 teens who were on the retreat. Where are the kids? I know where they are, they are taking their sacrament and running. So, go ahead, sit around and pretend that everything is fine. Your remarks to discredit the old YM (Her name is Marie McCaig) are pathetic. Really? After all she did to humbly and lovingly share the faith with hundreds and hundreds of our teens, how could you be so low?
ReplyDelete2:23- You are incorrect. In the past, parents were always welcome but my kids never wanted me around, whether at the regular meetings on Sunday nights or at the retreats. So what is your point? We were always invited to help but if your child doesn't want you there, why impose? Besides, leading teens in ministry is a gift and we don't all have it. There was always plenty of help with parents and non-parents, so what is your point? Is it wrong to get other people involved? Cory specifically stated at a meeting I attended that he wanted people to be Core Leaders WHO WERE NOT PARENTS, so what is your point? Several young people did get involved as Core Leaders and they have all quit! In fact, he wrote in the bulletin that he wanted to interview and train 25-30 Core Leaders- not a very realistic goal, all things considered.
ReplyDelete2:23 You are correct. Most of the teens that are of-age now to participate are not familiar with how things used to be, so they aren't gaging their current experience on an experience of the past. This fact makes it even more disturbing that they aren't supporting the new program and Cory. Don't you think? Word of mouth is how things grow. When the program is not growing, the word that is out is not favorable. It's nearly impossible to undue the damage of first impressions.
ReplyDeleteTo above, 9:56- Couldn't disagree with you more, if common sense were to prevail, we would'nt be in the mess we are in.
ReplyDeleteIt all comes down to a single individual.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous 2:13, People who live in glass houses ought not to throw stones. If Prolife issues and the March for Life had ever been a priority in this parish, I'm sure the turnout each year for the pilgrimage would've been better. In fact, what happened this year? No bus. When was the last time our parish filled a bus with pilgrims? Parish kids who wanted to go weren't able to because of the way in which it was handled. However, the FBI group and Horseheads had full buses. Why? Please stop blaming Marie and look inward. Ask God to open your blind eyes.
ReplyDeleteThe adults in our parish are hardly engaged, so how would you expect the youth to be? There are a few of the faithful who make this pilgrimage almost every year in our parish. Do you know who they are? Are you one of them?
Do you say rosaries in front of the Planned Parenthood in Corning? Are you engaged in the Respect Life Committee? Do you attend vigil masses for the unborn when offered? Are they even offered in our parish? Do you speak up when abortion comes up in conversation with friends and co-workers? Do you prayerfully support the Prolife movement? Do you engage the young people in your life on this issue?
I have been to the March for Life twice in the last three years. Both times I saw Marie with lots of kids. She is obviously doing something right.
What parish staff cannot seem to accept is that the issues surrounding the fractured youth group will not go away. Those who rule us with a sense of entitlement and arrogance instead of a servant's heart continue on in the same way. It is a spiritual problem that calls out for the Holy Spirit. At this point, humility and penance on the part of leadership would be a start.
In comment to 9:56 my remarks were not to discredit what Marie McCaig did or did not do. The program was good but unfortunately we do not live in a perfect world. We came in from another parish that had a very active youth group with both social activities and instruction, in comparing it to what we were used to my teenagers were disappointed even though we thought alot of the Mrs, McCaig. They attended youth group, but there was very little time to socialize and get to know anyone except for the once a year retreat. I wish that they could have had some of the experiences that I now hear the FBI is doing because that is what they experienced at our other parish. Change is always hard.
ReplyDeleteIt was also our experience that a handful of teens and the same parents were always at any of the fund raisers or activities that went on. Attendance was very high for the retreat, but many of those teens never took part in anything else. I was glad to see that the teens did have an opportunity this year to attend a retreat. I am sure that the first ones that the McCaigs held were not as big as the later ones were. It does take time for a program to be built up and hopefully those core group of teens through word of mouth will be able to do this.
Gretchen just wondering how much you were involved with the youth group when Marie McCaig was in charge and did your teens take part in any of the programs then or since they have started the FBI group. Maybe you should think about not throwing stones in a glass house. When the trouble started with the youth group did you attend any of the parent meetings and voice your opinion about what a good job Mrs. McCaig was doing? My point was that if this was a priority why didn't the youth attend before last year with the FBI. I did not hear of any parish kids who wanted to go and couldn't go because of the way it was handled. It is my understanding that the bus to the March sponsored by the FBI was open to everyone.
ReplyDeleteThank you for your level-headed reason, 3:26. As one who has been involved in parish happenings for many years, your perspective is quite accurate. I don't seen any arguments on here about issues regarding the substance in the program, just about who is running it and who has the control, which I think is quite shallow. I don't have teens to send to our church program, but let us pray that parents get past their disagreements and do whats best for their children's spiritual life and faith formation!
ReplyDelete3:26 Sorry to disagree, but my kids are involved in the FBI and my senior daughter was always involved in the old program- the FBI kids are doing many of the things they did before, only in a bigger capacity. They had service projects before- where were you? They visited the elderly before- where were you? They wrote letters to shut-ins- where were you? They made stockings at Christmas time- where were you? They raked and cleaned for the elderly- where were you? Again, where were you? I'm sure I have forgotten many of the wonderful things that were accomplished but I hope you get my point because you are attempting to discredit what both Marie and Mike did but few will buy into it. And, by the way, she was a part-time employee, wasn't she? In this regard, we should be getting twice as much bang for our buck now.
ReplyDeleteCheryl
2:13, 2:23 and 3:26 obviously you are the same person because there could not possibly be 3 people who are so foolish. ARE YOU FREAKING KIDDING ME? Over 120plus kids were going to a youth group meeting every Sunday night and you are whining because they didn't have enough social time????? I whined because I couldn't get a parking spot to pick my kids up and now look what we've got. Unbelievable. I wanted my children catechized and cared for and they were. Thank you Marie and Mike.
ReplyDelete3:26 FYI- you can't compare what was to what is. When there are only 12 or so kids at a gathering, social interaction is easy. When Marie did it, there were always 100 kids at a meeting and her role was to educate. I was fine with this and so were my children. They get enough of the social stuff at school and on their teams.
ReplyDeleteChris
Anonymous 3:43, We moved to this parish after Marie had been ousted. We attended two youth council meetings, in which the parents and youth group volunteers were urging the pastoral administrator to reinstate Marie and to heal the rift. We had no clue what was going on, but knew something was seriously wrong, so we stopped attending. As newcomers, we felt we didn't have much to offer. We attended the final youth retreat at the parish run by the McCaigs, however. We volunteered in the kitchen. It was fantastic, and my kids, who attended, agreed.
ReplyDeleteRegarding the bus -- our parish bulletin advertised for weeks that our parish would be sending a bus to the March. I personally know of one teen who wanted to go and was expecting to be able to go with the parish youth group. By the time she found out no parish bus was going it was too late to sign on with the FBI bus -- it was filled.
4:06 If you had kids in the program and listened to what they have shared, you would understand why there is lack of support.
ReplyDeleteMust be there was a Parish Council or Youth Group meeting last night and and it must have been decided that some of you needed to go on this blog to defend the current YM while trying to discredit Marie and the many years of that she faithfully serving the youth of our parish. How PATHETIC!! @ 1/31 2:13PM-To criticize that she never took the teens to March for Life while she was the YM at ASP...really?? Marie was a PART TIME employee of ASP with multiple children at home. She was at almost every school & sporting event, Graduation parties & teens celebrations, volunteered in the schools, sewed costumes and worked backstage on the plays, and participated in Booster Club to name a few. She even did these things for the HS when she did not have a child in the school. Her door was always open for our teens. She was there for them no matter what. She CARED for the kids. No hidden agendas! She ran a vibrant YG program and was and still is loved and repected by the teens in this community Catholics and non Catholics alike!
ReplyDeleteAnd as far as March for Life... and the ASP YG not going...Cory is a single man who is employed FULL TIME by ASP, and he could not make a couple of phone calls and organize a bus, when a system is already in place through Chemung County Right for Life to set it up quite easily. It appears to me that it didn't happen due to shear laziness or the fact that he didn't want to get it together because he might have to compete with the FBI??
@ 1/31 2:23PM... My kids were involved when Marie was YM and there are many senior high kids that attend the FBI that were also. So we know how it "was". As far as the recent ASP Retreat and it being the first one so how would we know that we wouldn't like it, if you don't like what is offered at the Sunday evening program, why would you want to sit through it for 2 days?
The FBI has a retreat coming up Feb. 20-21st. My kids and and well over 100 more will be there!
4:06 Who is running it is everything! You can't really believe otherwise. If so, you better get your head out of the sand. The church is no different than anything else- there are coaches in this district that my son will never play for. His choice and I wouldn't either. You're either good with kids or you're not and kids are the best judge.
ReplyDelete6:46 My 2 will be there too. We received our invitation in the mail today and it was as welcomed as much as the "snow day" announcement! It's pretty incredible that despite some division among the adults, the kids all come together. They really don't care about all of the behind-the-scene politics, they just want to have a faith experience with their friends. So, whether it be through the parish or through the FBI, maybe we can all agree that the most important thing is that there are options and opportunities for our teens. Let's face it, all teens are not created equal. Some will navigate toward a small, intimate group and their needs are better met and some thrive in a larger-group environment. It might be nice if the 2 groups would collaborate occasionally but maybe it's not realistic.
ReplyDelete10:19pm: As I have followed this blog I could never figure out why so much dissention over the 2 groups for the kids. I don't have kids involved anymore but I used to and as far as I'm concerned, the more the better. Kids get to chose between soccer or football or cross country in the fall or basketball or track or volleyball in the winter. Having different chances to be successful are critical. So if kids are successful in their faith journey through the parish group- great. If they do better through Marie and the FBI, great. What difference does it make how they get to God, as long as they get there? Let's support them on their journey, unconditionally. I sense that a majority of the opposition comes from the staff- the message that the FBI is your nemesis has to stop. You are driving parents and their children away.
ReplyDeleteNancy
Nancy- So true, so true. Let's get behind the youth- no matter what.
ReplyDeleteNancy- You are on target but leave me wondering how the FBI group, who serves the community in many valuable ways, could be the enemy? I see the hand of Satan in all of this, as he seeks to destroy all good that is from God. He is the true nemesis.
ReplyDeleteThe FBI group is what it is.. a great group of teens who are involved, active and giving of their time in various service projects. Who benefits? The kids do, the community does and the elderly delight in seeing them often. The adults who support them are both parents and friends, listeners and supporters. No one asks to be spotlighted or above anyone else, most of all Marie and Mike..never have, never will. Ask any teens from the present or past who have been involved a lot, or off and on, and you'll hear postive and rewarding experiences and memories. All of us parents will attest to the fact that kids know what's going on. They will attach themselves to adults who are sincere and always there for them unconditionally..no gimmicks. That's why it is a successful gathering and why the FBI retreat is well attended without twisting anyone's arm.
ReplyDeleteJust recovering from having the kids home for 2 days and would like to respond to the person(s) who posted at 2:13 and 2:23. I was one of the parents you refer to- I never staffed a retreat, even though I was asked by Marie if I would consider it. Why? Because I was and am still intimidated by 150-175 teens. It's that simple. I will cook, I will clean, I will do whatever, but I won't be a staff person. I hope you don't think that makes me a bad parent but I recognize where my weaknesses are. Besides, my kids wouldn't go if I was there. Also, about the comment you made about kids going to the retreat and then never coming to youth group. There was some of this going on because the retreats were opened up to all denominations, so naturally these other teens would not come to a Catholic youth group. Also, there were a ton of kids coming to the Sunday night program, so most of them must have been doing both the retreat and the youth group activities. I remember when my oldest was a junior and she went to the Steubenville retreat and they filled 2 chartered buses. So, again, it wasn't just about the retreat, these kids were involved in other things. I also remember the Service week they used to do and how a ton of kids showed up to work their butts off. So, I think you are wrong about a few of the things you are stating. Like I said, I wasn't a staff adult but we were involved and I have not forgotten all the things that used to happen to help our children.
ReplyDeleteHe said, she said, FBI, ASP YG, who cares. How many teens involved now vs. how many participated 5 yrs ago?
ReplyDeleteAn effective, real parish leader would have ended this nonsense long ago. Big void at the top, both in Corning & Rochester.
You got that right mister!
ReplyDeleteMany care. Sorry you don't. If you had kids, maybe you would. But you are right, big void in parish leadership, BIG VOID.
ReplyDeleteChannel 8 news in Rottenchesta interviewed our bishop yesterday. When asked if he was going to retire early......NO. Oh well.
ReplyDeleteSad news. We must trust that God has a plan. Somehow, someday, He will lead us out of this darkness.
ReplyDeleteDoes the parish leader have his kids involved in ASP youth programs?
ReplyDeleteYes- his sons were on the Ignite retreat. Of course he supports the youth program! Why would anyone ask such a question?
ReplyDeleteWhy? Because he used to send his children to Victory for formation. Hello??????
ReplyDeleteHe supports HIS program is exactly correct because previously they were not in atendance at any of the retreats..too busy at Victory Hgwy. Maybe that's why "anyone would ask such a question".
ReplyDeleteAre his kids involved in the youth programs at ASP now on a regular basis? Are his younger children in faith formation at ASP now on a regular basis?
ReplyDeleteOf course they are involved now! He has molded the new program to meet his needs. He's got a puppet on a string and everything is good in his eyes. So what if we are missing 75% of the kids...who cares about them? As long as we can brag in the bulletin how good things are going, that's what matters.
ReplyDeleteYes- the Condon children are participating. He is very happy with the current programs.
ReplyDeleteDean supports "his" program. It would look rather bad if he didn't, don't ya think?
ReplyDeleteAlways about him..never about the kids..about him and his "program"..can't make this stuff up people.
ReplyDelete