Thursday, September 23, 2010

To the top...

Can we bring this thread up to the top? Please start commenting here. The last three comments posted are:

Anonymous said...

Auburn - population ~28,000 - 7 churches
Elmira - population ~39,000 - 6 churches
Elmira Heights - population ~4,000 - 1 church
Corning - population ~11,000 - 3 churches

Demographically, not accounting for population density, we should look at Auburn and see what we can model on and borrow from them.

Obviously this is back of the envelope, as the number of churches and the population of, say, Rochester is hard to make a direct correlatation between poplation and churches serving that population. I am sure the population density of the ABC Parish would also be skewed as the populations and square mileage of the parish being served by those churches is interesting. Although you could segment the population of the specific townships and the local church serving that township.

Question - could Corning support 2 parishes? September 23, 2010 12:34 PM 

Joe said..

Just crunching numbers for the heck of it- the total population for above is 82,000. Divide this by the number of churches covering this population, 17, and you come up with an average population of 4,823 PER ONE CHURCH. With our population of 11,000, sustaining 2 Churches should not be an issue. The fact that it is an issue, is the issue. September 23, 2010 12:47 PM

Chris said...

Auburn is a very conservative, traditional parish. Need I say more? Much credit to the late Father Shammon.
September 23, 2010 1:01 PM 


  1. You people are not getting it. 1) Our expenses are more than our income. This is not new; this has been going on since well before Deacon Dean showed up! 2) Deacon Dean is not going to leave. Time to get over it! 3) Marie McCaig is gone, she is not coming back. Time to get over it! 4) Cory is doing a very good job trying to re-start the youth group. Time to get involved and make it better 4) We have an offer on St. V that has not been accepted. 5) We only have 1350 people that show-up to mass every week, we do not need 3 churches (see number 1 above) 6) Soon we will only have one Priest who will not be able to support 3 churches. 7) You are only a vocal minority. Only 100 people showed to the meeting. That’s 100 people out of 1350 people who attend mass, not a big percentage, please stop trying to convince yourself you are bigger than you are. 8) Listen to Juan C he is trying to lead you on the right path now. He is the new voice of reason of the SOP Core team......
    I am done visiting this website, I no longer find any value, you are not attempting to move on you are stuck and that is not the way to “Save our Parish”!

  2. 1) Our income has decreased significantly in the last 3 years. Read the bulletin
    2) How do you know this?
    4) The kids are a good judge of how well things are going
    4) Not accepted but the implication has been that it is intended to be
    5) What happened to our Catholics in Corning?
    6)There is no outcry to save IHM but we are hoping to maintain 2 Churches. One priest can handle 2 Churches, many in the country are
    7)100 is a decent number
    8) Don't know him but if you say so

    Sorry to hear this. We will miss you. It's always good to have another voice of reason.

  3. Anonymous 9:31 PM...Amen, amen, amen. Just wanted to chime in that our income has NOT decreased over the past three years. According to the graph at the facilities meeting, collections I tracked up until I believe May/June 2010 remained absolutely stagnant since 2002. There was an uptick from 2000-2002, but that was short lived. And also to the above question of what happened to all our "catholics in corning"? My answer to that is they have died. Statistics have show that nationwide the majority of people that attend and give to their church regularly are baby boomers and the elderly. This is something that even crosses all Christian denominations. Corning is a town with a lot of gray hairs, and unfortunately we have to look at the reality (look around at the median age of people in ANY catholic church you go into) and realize that in 10-15 years we will see a vast majority of our congregation gone. Its not just youth that especially needs to be evangelized, but those in their 40s and younger!

  4. Thanks, anonymous, for your list. 1) Per the facilities meeting, our giving has remained static at about $800,000 per year. What is new, is the proposal for a 10-year projected $200,000 per year deficit (double the deficit of today), with less valuable property and nothing in the proposed budget for capital improvements.
    2)The issue isn't who is in charge, it's about the question of working together to solve our problems and include parishioners in the process.
    3)Why do you keep bringing up Marie? You should get over it.
    4)Cory and the youth ministry need our prayers and support.
    5)How many churches we need should not be determined solely by one person or even a committee's opinion. This is something that should involve the entire parish community--each step of the way.
    6)One priest certainly can (and in many instances do) service two or three churches; especially with the numerous deacons and laity involved in assisting.
    7)Sounds like you were at the meeting. The room holds 100 people, so we were full. How many people comprise the committees who made the decision to sell our churches? Web stats and petition signatures show that many more than 100 people are not in support of sale of SV and are seeking answers not currently provided by leadership. A group of parishioners who have been denounced from the pulpit were able to pull together a great group of people to brainstorm ideas and possible solutions. They will be presented next week at the parish council meeting. Hope you are there.
    8)We love Juan! We do listen to him, but remember, this is a forum in which all are free to express their feelings. Some positive, some not so positive. You seem to be stuck and focused on the negative. Most of us are not.

  5. Struggling to believe the statements about the collection being stagnant since 2002. I have saved alot of bulletins and the collections of recent months are all-time low. 2-3 years ago, most collections were in the neighborhood of $15,000. Now we are seeing numbers as low as $7,000 and some only slightly higher.

  6. 11:42: Parishioners have died but this does not fully account for the few in the pews. Parishioners are in other parishes or they are not attending mass. We have failed them. Not the Church, we. Our mission should be to find these people and bring them back, in spite of the poor leadership.

  7. In this weeks bulletin, Deacon Dean says that the Providence House people recently stated that the Saint Mary's campus did not possess any value to a developer because "the costs of redevelopement would far outweigh any financial gain." Aren't they planning to raze the Saint Vincent's Church? Why wouldn't they do the same with Saint Mary's? Perhaps they determined that the location of Saint Mary's makes it less appealing to seniors?

  8. to 9:31pm
    1-Let's not focus on the past- presently our collections are way low because people have left or are choosing to withhold

    2-He should be giving this some serious thought, really- he should.

    3- Yes- she's gone but so is my father and I still can grieve for him, can't I? Much was lost.

    4- If he is doing a good job, why are you concerned about him? Good things will happen under good leadership

    4- Don't think it will be- have you driven through the neighborhood lately? PH would be crazy to move forward.

    5- Do you know why parishioners have left the Church?

    6- If we all come together to help, 1 Priest can accomodate 2-3 Churches.

    7- When's the last time the parish had a meeting and 100 people showed up? Some masses don't even have this number.

    8- Juan has some great insight- one of many who do

    We will continue to attempt to Save Our Parish- with or without your support.

  9. @ September 23, 2010 9:31 PM

    All we are saying is you do not sell the house because it needs a new roof.

    The effort is to do a thorough investigation of what maintenance is needed versus wanted, on an item-by-item level; to divine a way to bring back those who are and have been chased away from ASP; to formulate a solid financial plan to turn the finances around; and above all, not take an action that is irreversible.

    If all is said and done, and the answer is the proposal before us, then we can say this is when we became a united parish.

    Have you seen the view at the corner of Denison Parkway and Steuben Street? That is what we are trying to avoid.

  10. Intentions Offered

    - For the SOP group to find peace in their hearts and to practice true Christian behavior

    To whoever posted this on the prayer page: I will pray for you. Truly, truly, I will.

  11. Who would post something like that? Let me guess....

  12. SOP did not originate the prayer intention mentioned above; it came in as a submission, which we then posted. We hope and pray the intention was a sincere effort to solicit divine aid. Readers can decide for themselves.

  13. Did we all listen to Father Fred this weekend. He hit it right on the nose. Time for us all come together. Are we (all of us) the reason he is leaving?

  14. I think he is leaving because of 2 reasons: his 105 year is old mother is ill and there are problems with his green card. But who could blame him if the state of the parish was a factor. It's not easy being a parishioner right now, it's hard to imagine being one of the priests. Without pointing fingers at anyone in particular, we need someone to come in here who can bring parishioners back and together. This should be our prayer.