Monday, October 11, 2010
Dinner & Dialogue
If you didn't already know, Deacon Dean and the parish staff are hosting a Dinner & Dialogue for parishioners on Thursday, Oct. 21, 7 p.m., at All Saints Academy Gym. It may be a good opportunity to ask questions about the sale of St. Vincent's, or whatever else you may be wanting to know. To RSVP (by Oct. 19), call 936-4689, ext. 210. Thanks to parish leadership for planning the event. Details here.
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
Not interested in Dinner and Dialogue. Seems a little too late for dialogue. A decision was made without our input, is there any value in discussing it?
ReplyDeleteAnn,
ReplyDeleteWhy are you so negative? What hurt is there in inviting parishioners to break bread together and have an open conversation? Isn't this what you folks have been asking for- open dialogue?I'm "just wondering" when you are going to accept that this is a done deal. Our finance council, our parish council, our facilities committee, our parish staff and our Pastoral Administrator are all in agreement. We are going to sell Saint Vincents and IHM. We are going to have one campus. Maybe it's time you and your friends got on board. Give it a try. Maybe a positive attitude will bear positive fruits. Worth a try.
The open dialogue should have happened months ago. Who is parish leadership trying to appease by doing so now? I am not impressed that Dean has the support of so many on staff and on the councils- he clearly does not have the support of the majority of his parishioners. And this will be his downfall. So, I'm "just wondering" why I and my friends should get on board.
ReplyDeleteJust wondering, may I ask a question? Why are you lumping everyone on this site into one group? Hundreds visit this site every day and they have differing opinions. Ann expressed hers. Please stop trying to marginalize parishioners as 'you folks'. It sounds very much like you are trying to frame the argument as an 'us versus them' situation. We are all in the same parish, even though we have differing opinions about how to proceed.
ReplyDeleteI do see 2 distinct groups- those who support Dean and those who don't. Those who like Dean and those who don't. Those who trust parish leadership and those who don't. Those who have stayed and those who have left. Those who are committed to saving our parish and those who only talk about saving our parish. So, I guess I am framing an "us versus them situation". It's pretty claer to me that the line has been drawn in the sand. I prefer the side I am standing on.
ReplyDeleteWhat makes you think that we Save Our Parish by destroying parts of it? We get rid of key employees (Check out the fruits of that move).A select group of people make the decisions to sell properties(No division created on that move) We refuse to give the parishioners a chance to Save Their Parish (Who needs these parishioners- they just get in the way.)We support a leader who is unpopular.(Isn't this the real problem?)Let's talk about the fruits- did I hear that there is only 1 person in the RCIA program? Did I hear that we are padding the collection to off-set the low contributions? Did I hear that the real reason we don't have a Priest here to cover for Father Fred is because none want to come here? In spite of the negativity, I am optimistic that change is coming- wait and see.
ReplyDeleteI prefer standing on the side of right, regardless of who is with me. It might be you and the parish staff and councils. It might not be. But the least we all deserve in this parish is an open sharing of information that allows us to make an informed judgement about the direction we are headed. Could you at least agree with that, justwonderin'?
ReplyDeleteWe have been given free will by God, but to use it we have to gather information, examine our conscience and pray for guidance. As a parish our direction should be a function of making choices together. Putting your trust in a single person or small group of people is really a personal decision. If forced to follow against our best judgment we surrender our free will and throw away a wonderful gift. “Just wondering” is exercising free will and all I ask is that we (the parish) be given the same respect. In the end, even with different opinions, we all are still one parish, All Saints Parish - All One right!
ReplyDelete"Justwonderin" if the Diocese staff has read that this is a done deal. It appears that the writing is on the wall and now in print on the blog. "Justwonderin" if you realize what you've done!
ReplyDeleteWhat will it take for you people to see this for what it is? You show up at a Parish Council meeting all ready to tell us what we've done wrong and how you're going to fix everything and then you don't offer one concrete idea that can be used as a solution. Fundraising is the best plan you have. Well, sorry, but this community is fundraised out- just ask those involved with the West band trip to London. We need to plan for one Church that is sustainable by the ones who are committed enough to stay. As for the rest of you, nobody's going to beg you to come back or to stay 'cause we all know you are exercizing your God-given free will that John refers to. If you don't want to move on, please get out of the way, so that we can.
ReplyDeleteJust wondering why you are so angry and why we can't be friends? Contrary to what you state,I do want to move on. I want All Saints Parish to thrive. I want those who have left, to come back. I want parishioners to trust parish staff. I want pancake breakfasts, Bingo and pasta dinners. I want our Priests to be revered. I want a Pastoral Administrator who can earn my confidence. I want our Parish to be Eucharistic centered. I want healing. I want every Church filled at every mass. I want to be fed solid food. I want every parishioner to know Jesus Christ through the Catholic Church. This is what moving on looks like to me. Can you buy into this? Or is your moving on exclusive to tearing down Churches?
ReplyDelete"Just wondering"...Fundraising for WHS one time Band Trip and fundraising to help our parish survive and flourish long into the future don't even belong in the same sentence. Fundraising for our parish will help rebuild our parish community...two benefits...frankly, the "rebuilding of community" presently seems far more important than generating income.
ReplyDeleteMuch of the analysis that has happened over the past 3 or more years regarding our parish has left out a key element -- the people! If a pulpit appeal was made for money to save people from being let go or churches from being sold or even asking us (the parishioners)for our input then, I must have missed that.
St. Paul comments that "God placed the parts, each one of them, in the body as he intended. If they were all one part, where would the body be? But as it is, there are many parts, yet one body." (Cor. 12:18-20) We are all members of the Body of Christ. As members of that Body, of which Christ is the head (no one else) we should have a "say" in what happens with our church/parish. That is all I think anyone no matter what "side" you are on, wants!
As a part of the SOP core team, I was at the Parish Council meeting. I do not recall where anyone from SOP said the Parish Council/Leadership was wrong. I do recall there being several insults flung in our direction though. ("Let those among you without sin cast the first stone.") As for solutions or "concrete ideas" as you called them...we said we would offer some possible alternatives AND ways to "conserve" money or increase income. We did that with the help of other parishioners. A solution or workable plan of implementation should be the responsibility of parish administration, if that is what they desire. Furthermore, regardless of how many worship sites we have, a sound financial plan needs to be in place first.
Finally, I am committed enough to stay...and, I want a plan that includes TWO churches...and, I WANT BACK ALL OF THE PARISHIONERS THAT HAVE LEFT.
Just wondering who the financial expert is that is advising your group? You say that you have ideas to save the parish from financial ruin but present nothing that hasn't been considered. Don't you think that every stone was turned as parish reps. studied the parish finances? Every practical idea to conserve money and increase income was considered. In the end, creating one church is the best solution. Your solution is lawn signs (they do little more than send a message that the local Catholics can't get along), withholding money (Look at the numbers- others are kicking in to make up for the rest of you), running away to neighboring parishes (how committed were these people to begin with?), blaming everything on Deacon Dean (Wait a minute, didn't you people crab about Sister Joan as well?) Retaliation hardly leads to reconciliation.
ReplyDeleteAll- As I witnessed the miraculous recovery of the miners in Chile, I was touched as several rescued miners made the sign of the cross as they emerged from their hell. The power of the cross. Let us not lose confidence that we too will be rescued from this cross, through the cross.
ReplyDeletejustwonderin' said...
ReplyDelete"Don't you think that every stone was turned as parish reps. studied the parish finances? Every practical idea to conserve money and increase income was considered."
What about Prayer?
Do you think you SOP people are the only people who know how to pray? Of course, we prayed. Every meeting included prayer. Your implication that we are acting without praying is presumptuous and erroneous. I feel confidant that God has answered our prayers with a unexpected offer from Providence House. I suppose you think otherwise.
ReplyDeleteI didn't indicate that you acted without praying and I do not presume that only we (SOP) knows how to pray. Where I do feel that an error was made was in not bringing this issue (of selling SVdP)to the entire parish for prayer and discernment.
ReplyDeleteGod may well have answered your prayers but to say that He answered the entire parish's prayers is, as you put it, "presumptuous and erroneous."
Do you think it is possible for God to answer everybody's prayer in the way they desire? Sometimes the answer is yes to one and no to another. I stand by my statement that God has answered the prayer of those who are committed to Saving Our Parish. If you don't like the way it's playing out, well, then you better talk to Him.
ReplyDeleteIn my profession we were taught, that when there is a conflict, both sides are entitled to have their side heard. It appears you consider "your" side to be the truth and that it should end there. What about "our" side. It's just as valid to us. You are harboring internal anger and I am "justwonderin" if you were able to make it to Adoration to ask God to help you with that? In case you didn't, I'm praying for you.
ReplyDeleteWhether or not I chose to participate in adoration is no reflection on my prayer life. I can pray in my garage or in line at Walmart- don't you think all prayers are heard? Think of the miners in Chile and then tell me that their prayers weren't good enough. Adoration is one of many ways to pray.
ReplyDeleteJustwondering if you are diminishing the power of the Eucharistic presence? Certainly, I can pray in the shower, in the car on the way to work, on my coffee break, during my lunch hour and all the way home. I can have some quality conversations with our dear Lord. BUT I WOULD RATHER BE WITH HIM. I would rather sit before Him. I would rather see Him, hidden in the bread. I would rather gaze upon Him, hidden in the bread. There is no earthly time when we will be closer to Him than while in His Eucharistic presense. I have no problem with you praying in line at Walmart but do not equate this time of prayer to prayer before the Blessed Sacrament. If I learned that Mahmoud Ahmedinejod had just launched the "big one" and it was headed to Corning, NY. I wouldn't run to Walmart. Nope. You'd find me in the Church, sittin' with Jesus.
ReplyDeleteTired of arguing about who has the better prayer.
ReplyDeleteHeard some people were complaining that nobody from the staff signed up for adoration. Did it ever occur to any of you that the staff spends more time in the church than all of you put together? For the love of God, they WORK in the church and yet you criticize us for not spending time in the church. Sometimes it feels like all you people want to do is complain.
I don’t think the topic is who has the better prayer so much as what is an optimum place to pray, given a choice. We all pray where we are and in whatever situation we find ourselves. If, as you aver, time spent in a church is a condition of holiness, then our parish should be full of saints. But the pews are full of sinners, whether they work in the church or not. Wouldn’t you agree? I think the condition of holiness has more to do with how well we are following Christ Jesus.
ReplyDelete4thetruth. Thank you for these thoughts. They've solidified a flood of feelings that came out of my midnight nights at the adoration. To all, I don't think the purpose of this blog is to characterize people's faith or prayer life. We, as a parish, are trying to figure out a difficult situation. There are strong feelings all around. Honest and thoughtful feelings. Perhaps rather than praying for our specific viewpoint we can pray together to discern God's will and to accept it as it becomes more clear. As was stated above, that does not mean we get a yes.
ReplyDeletejustwondering why do you sound so bitter?
ReplyDelete4thetruth...always enjoy your posts.
Bill...glad to hear from you again. I agree that "we can (and should) pray together to discern God's will and to accept it as it becomes more clear...that does not mean we (MAY) get a yes." I am struggling with the fact that the decision is made -- we can pray together and discern but it doesn't matter because God's will for our parish has been discerned (by a select group of people) and we must be "All Saints. All One."
I have asked myself that "If the majority of registered parishioners were independently surveyed (after a period of prayer and discernment) and the majority decided that selling SVdP was truly in our parish's best interest how would I then feel about the decision to sell? I believe I would be okay with that. It would be a bit of a struggle for me in the beginning (I just can't get my heart around the idea of tearing down a place of God -- removing a tabernacle)...but I would stand with and by, my fellow parishioners.
Bill...that prayer and discernment of God's will needs to be done TOGETHER as a parish in order for the entire parish to wholeheartedly accept God's will...whether it be a yes or a no.
Since that hasn't happened...I guess we are stuck praying for our "specific viewpoints."
There is so much passion here on this site. PLEASE ATTEND tonight, even if you have to RSVP at the last minute. You can indicate you are not eating. Let your voice be heard!
ReplyDelete